Story by Brad Balfour
Thanks to the success of director Zach Cregger’s astoundingly weird horror film, “Weapons,” its male lead, actor Josh Brolin, is getting attention way beyond expectation. Everything about the film is a bit askew, turning on the mysterious disappearance of 17 third graders from one class at 2:17 am.Only one kid remains in the class and though no one finds that odd initially, the onus is on teacher Justine Sandy [Julia Garner]. She becomes a pariah and is especially harassed by Archer [Brolin] whose son is one of the missing. The film is framed in chapters named for the character that each chapter focuses on.
Then, halfway through the film, all is revealed. The focus shifts from what happened to how can we save them? Where they are is clear but how they are to be freed from the force holding them in stasis is the mysterious and ultimately, terrifying question. In the course of getting an answer, Brolin’s character goes from being nasty to becoming a savior of sorts. It’s within that turn that Brolin is getting the praise for taking on this film. It might actually be the sleeper hit of the summer.
Not that Brolin hasn’t prompted accolades and critical attention before for the many films he’s been in. But most of them have not had Brolin as the lead carrying the film. Nonetheless, a crop of critically and financially capable directors such as David O Russell, Ridley Scott, Denis Villeuneuve, Paul Verhoven and the Coen brothers to cite a few.
Brolin may not be the most intense guy in the room, but he makes even the most intense parts he’s played seem like something that comes to him naturally. It’s like second nature to him or so it seems.
That might make sense since he is a second-generation actor. His father James Brolin made a mark in television and mainstream movies but never garnered the kind of attention his son has grabbed. While the younger Brolin was born in Santa Monica, he was really raised on a ranch. He became more of a surf bum than actor since he had little exposure to Hollywood growing up.
Once he decided to pursue acting, it didn’t come all that easy or early. Though the Richard Donner-directed film “The Goonies” (1985) put him on the map, it took years before he finally hit his stride.
Making his way through TV series and bit parts, he finally hit his breakthrough: he landed a key role in the Coen brothers’ Academy Award-winning film “No Country for Old Men” (2007). In fact, Josh was trading stocks full time when he booked that part. And while the 57-year-old has done many award-nominated films, he’s still coming into his own as a leading man. So in a strange way, “Weapons” may provide the gateway for his leading man status.
Tackling a talk by Brolin is a challenge. He has such a wide-ranging career and so many great films under his belt that it’s hard to discuss his career within a short period. Yet, at the previous New York Comic-Con, he did spend an hour and a little more sharing with the packed audience an entangled survey of his creative life. Below is an abbreviated and re-organized edit of that discussion.
Acting
Q: What do you think would surprise people about being an actor in Hollywood?
Josh Brolin: Oh, how flawed we are. Nobody got that. But would people be surprised at how nervous we get?
Q: Before you step on set, or just in general?
Josh Brolin: In general. For the most part, in a really sweet way, actors start out very insecure. I did. I was so scared to speak in public. I was paralyzed. My trachea would close up and my knees would shake. I did an episode of “Highway to Heaven” with Michael Landon way back in the day when I was 17 years old. I auditioned for him.
I remember I threw down a pencil or something. I think that’s why I got the job, because I felt free enough to throw down a pencil at his desk. He looked at me like, “He’s a badass.” But I did it. I remember the whole experience. I’ve seen it since — recently, actually. I wanted to go back because I remembered how scared I was. Most of my focus was to keep my legs as straight as they could possibly be because my knees were shaking so bad.
I just went forward and kept challenging myself. My dad says, “I remember when you went to war and basically went to war with your own fears.” I started doing theater and doing all the things that you don’t do when you’re scared. I think one day I just got used to being scared. Or I just created a different relationship with fear. And here I am.
Marvel – Thanos
Q: This is a Marvel question. How early in the process were you cast as Thanos. Did you find out, or did you know, ultimately the big arc? Did you know what you were actually getting into when you first signed on?
Josh Brolin: Nothing! For real. I was cast when I was doing –– I can’t remember who the gentleman’s name — but he dropped off a Bible at my hotel when I was getting ready to do “Everest” or I was already doing “Everest.” There was some talk about playing this guy, Thanos, and it was basically a cameo, which I did a little for a couple of other movies. They said, “We’re thinking that the plan is that it’s going to have a much bigger impact later on, but we don’t know what that is yet.” I know that at Marvel — I don’t know if they do this so much anymore — but [Marvel Studios co-president] Lou D’Esposito, (who I knew as a first AD when I was doing “Hollow Man”) and [Kevin] Feige and all, I knew these people from before.
They would get together, rent a house in Palm Springs, flip burgers and go, “Okay, so, you know Thanos, right?” I’d be like, “Yeah, he’s like, the most powerful.” And it was then, “Okay, but not the most powerful… They’d have those conversations. It was after I said yes that it started. I didn’t, for a second, think that it was going to become what it became.
We were doing tests during the making of “Everest.” We were doing different types of things to my face to be able to… We weren’t doing dots, we were doing painting. So they weren’t technically there, but it it was a perfect storm where they technically arrived at what they needed in order for Thanos to [be alive]. I remember coming in — and I won’t bore you with this — but I was doing it for the first time in front of like 50 computers before we started those two movies.
I had had this Richard Burton thing in my head. Not actually Richard Burton, but it was much more formalized, like Thanos. The Russos [Joseph Vincent Russo and brother Anthony Russo who directed the Marvel films “Captain America: The Winter Soldier,” “Captain America: Civil War,” “Avengers: Infinity War” and “Avengers: Endgame”] were like, “No, just be.”
So we started to talk about what that was and they were like: just like sitting like this. That changed everything. The fact that it wasn’t this presentation of this, and then scratching the face or just normalizing the whole thing. Then we’d go and watch it. They’d go, “Yeah.” Then I’d start talking about things like Brando and “Apocalypse Now.” They’d go, “Yeah. Do that.” Then Me and Joe would start improvising back and forth, and that’s how it came to be.
Q: In the first act of “Endgame,” he gets killed. What the f*** ’s going on? You figured that’s a third act moment. What was it like for you reading that script for the first time and seeing how it was very unconventional?
Josh Brolin: I never read the script. I was given scenes to memorize which I diligently studied that were fake. [laughter] Like for real. Then I would come to work and they’d go, “Hey, there’s been some changes.” I’d go, “You motherfuckers, man.” I put a lot of onus on prepping. I like to be prepped and put a lot of work into it. But then I would show up at the end of the day and they’d be like, “If you need help with your lines, just call out for them.” I’d be like, “Dude, this is a whole speech.” But we pulled it off.
Q: What was your reaction when you heard that the Russos are coming back for “Secret Wars” and Part Two? It’s possible in “Secret Wars” because it’s a different universe that you could be reemerging in some other universe as a different version of the same character.
Josh Brolin: There’s a thing with playing Thanos. It’s like, “Oh, they’re going to bring Thanos back and all that.” It’s like “Sicario” [the Mexican cartel film directed by Denis Villeneuve]. It has to be right. It’s like Ryan Reynolds and I talking about Taylor Swift and we should be talking about “Deadpool 4” [Brolin played Cable in “Deadpool 2”]. We’d go back and forth and it’s like what in his mind fits, what in my mind fits and all that. Thanos has to fit if you’re going to bring him back. I would do anything that the Russos wanted me to do.
I loved playing Thanos, I loved being with the Russos; I loved their references. They would come up to me on set, and they’d be like, “You remember ‘Scarface.’” And I’d be like, “I thought this was like a Marvel movie.” They knew how to reference and get me going and all that. But I loved that the whole time. I just said to my agent, “I need to be scared, we need to find something.” And then that was off, and it’s good.
I’ll tell you a quick story. This is a very [Tom] Hiddleston story — who can’t wait to do Shakespeare. But there was a long, long speech, and he said –– “I just need you to gesture in this next one.” So the director said, “Ready, okay, action.”
And I went…. He was like, “That looks really dumb, don’t do that.” And I go, “Well, I don’t know what to do.” And he said, “Just do half the scene.” And I was like, “It doesn’t make sense to do half the scene.”
So I started, and had learned, and relearned this recently. And there were all these people… Glenn Close [was] down there, all these amazing actors. I started spouting off.
I won’t do the whole thing but I was like, “Pardon me, thy bleeding piece of earth. That I am meek and gentle with these butchers. Thou art the gruence, the noblest man that ever lived in the times. Woe to the hand that shed this costly blood over thy wounds. Now do I prophesy –– which like dumb mouths to oak their ruby lips affect the voice and utterance of my tongue –– a curse shall lie upon the limbs of men. Domestic fury and fierce civil strife shall thunder over all the parts of it. And blood and destruction shall be so in use in dreadful objects, so familiar that mothers shall but smile when they behold their infants quartered with the hands of war.”
Anyway, I went off. There was some applause afterwards. It just gave me something to do. And Glenn goes, “How the fuck did you do that?” I was like, “You’re Glenn Close. You’re asking me? That’s so cool.”
“Dune” & “Dune Part Two”
Q: Both “Dune” films are masterpieces. When you think back on the shooting of both films [Brolin played military attache Gurney Halleck], what’s a day or two you’ll always remember?
Josh Brolin: Denis and I were doing “Dune 2.” Denis called me and said, “I want you to write the song because we had done a song for ‘Dune 1’ and I did it in front of a bunch of people.” Denis gave it to me the night before. The song didn’t really work out. So he took it out and called me and felt really bad. He said, “I’m sorry. I have to cut this.” I was like, “No, cut it. It’s super bad.” Not that it’s that much better, but in the second one, he said, “I want you to write it with Hans.” I was like, “Hans …?” He said, “Zimmer.”
I was like, “You want me to write the song with Hans Zimmer? Okay.” And I did.Hans was vacationing at that point, so I wrote a bunch of lyrics and would send Hans lyrics. Then Hans was like –– he’s in Antarctica or something and would send back an iceberg. It got really frustrating at one point. I ended up calling Chris Stapleton, who’s a buddy, and said, “Would you help me write this song?” He said, “Yeah, I’ll do whatever you want. Just let me know.” Then I told Hans that and nothing really changed. He did send me some music. Anyway, it was a very strange process when we finally ended up in the Harvester [of spice] to do the scene.
They had hired an actor that came in from L.A. who was doing something that just wasn’t very ‘Dune.” He was just in a different tone. He was in a different movie. I kept looking at Denis going, “Like, what’s happening?” And he was like, “I don’t know.” And we have such a close relationship that we can do that. We don’t have to talk. We can just look at each other and basically say, “Is this a fucking problem, man?” Just keep going, keep going. Anyway, the day ended up, not totally, but ended up unusable.
The next day, he called me in the morning and said, “Come down here. We improvised that.” Even though we had the song, Hans had done the music on a basic level. We improvised the whole scene that you see with The Harvester. I think it turned out to be a really good reveal. It was the reveal of Gurney Halleck. And I really liked it. It basically had to do with understanding what was unusable. Something was off on that day. Denis is smart enough to go [with] something feels right now. I was nervous, but I think we did a good job.
Q: Greig Fraser was the cinematographer, the director of photography on both “Dune” films. He also shot “The Batman.” He’s shot so many great movies. He is one of the reasons –– like Denis, the actors, and the rest of the crew –– that’s why the film is so good. What was it like working with him? Why is Greig Fraser just so good at his job?
Josh Brolin: I’m very open about being inspired by people or by actors growing up, like being inspired by Gary Oldman and Daniel Day-Lewis and whoever else. I think Greig is very much the same. Roger Deakins was his guy. Roger Deakins and James Deakins have a podcast. We did a thing, and we turned the tables on them. Greig and I ended up interviewing them for one of their episodes, which was really interesting.
I think he’s incorporating all these new, amazing things, whereas Roger … even though Roger is technically brilliant and brought digital into it. But I remember when I got a call from Roger Deakins saying, “We’ve reached that point where you can’t…. Digital is better than film, from a lighting sense.” There’s just something super innovative about Greig, and I think he is becoming the best DP out there.
There’s some great DPs, but to me, he’s the best. Greig and I also did a book together; actually thats two books. One cost way too much. So nobody bought it. Then we took what we had done in “Dune II,” and made a “Dune” and “Dune Part 2” book. He would take pictures while we were filming. All with film because he loves film. He would get cameras from, like, flea markets and all that. We’d put these weird concoctions together, and take brilliant pictures. Then I did the writing for the book, and it became a bestseller, which was cool. You can buy it on Amazon, or other bookstores.
“The Goonies”
Q: Do you think if “The Goonies” [directed by Richard Donner] was released today, would it have the same impact as when it first came out?
Josh Brolin: I do. This is why I do. If nobody had ever seen it before, no. But I think it holds up because you have the reaction of generation after generation for 40 years this year. Right? We made it in 1984. It came out in 1987. When you raise your kids, you have “The Goonies” thing inside you. That makes it inevitable for your kids to like that movie when they finally see it because their parents are presenting it to them. They’re like, “Wait, do you fucking see this, man?” I really do. I’ve seen generation after generation with young kids coming up. But on the street, everywhere, they’re like, “Your brand. Your brand from The Goonies.” I’m like, “Yeah, I’m the guy who has shorts over his sweats. Nobody ever did that again.” [laughter] But I did.
Q: Whose idea was it to do this?
Josh Brolin: Man, I don’t know. Not a great idea but it stuck. Some of those things stick. Anyway, to answer the question, it doesn’t matter because it exists. I love seeing it go from grandparent to child and on and on and on. It was a fun movie. When I finished “The Goonies” I said, “Okay, that’s the way movies are made.” [Little did I know then.] And then I made “Thrashin’” and did the Michael Landon series and all that. I was like, “What the fuck happened to ‘The Goonies’?” Like, I’m all good. that was such a special, special, but also ….
Q: Was “The Goonies” your very first film?
Josh Brolin: First time I was ever in front of a camera. Everybody thinks, because my dad was an actor, that I grew up in Hollywood. I didn’t. I grew up in Paso Robles. I grew up in a horse ranch, feeding 65 horses and all that kind of thing. I didn’t grow up around Hollywood. I wasn’t used to it. I ruined half a day of filming.
The first day I filmed was the scene with Sean Astin where I’m doing the …. What was it? What’s that contraption where you’re doing the chest exercise thing? I ruined half a day because I couldn’t stop laughing. They’d go, “Action!” And I’d go, “Hee, hee, hee. This is so dumb!” Then I got over that. I realized that it was costing people money.
Q: Here’s a question from Ke Huy Quan [a fellow actor from Goonies]: There’s two parts to my question. The first part is, What is your favorite memory from making the Goonies? And the second part is, Who is your favorite Goonie?
Josh Brolin: My favorite moment. I wrote a book and it’s in there. My favorite moment was –– they wouldn’t let us see the ship the whole time they were building it. We finally ended up on the Warner Brothers lot and we were shooting in different stages but they wouldn’t let us see the ship. Then finally the moment came, I think four and a half months into filming. And they lined us up, backed us in, had us close our eyes. They said, “We want you to go underwater.”
They had speakers underwater. They had all the cameras set up and said, “We want you guys … because we’re coming off this slide, that’s the cut. And we want you to come up from under the water and turn around.” And they’re going to get all of our real reactions to the ship. The ship was spectacular, ultimately.
We were backed into it. We had our eyes closed, and we went underwater. I hear it in this muffled, kind of, “Okay, you guys ready? Action, roll it, action, and go. Goonies, go.”
We went up and turned around and I said, “Fuck!”. So Corey [Feldman] went, “What?”
“I’m sorry! Holy shit man. Look at that, look at that thing!” And they go, “No!”. So we had to do it over a couple of times. That’s a true story. We had to act that one, because Josh fucked it up.
Q: It’s surprising you booked another gig.
Josh Brolin: I know, that’s true. Me too. Here’s my favorite goon, they’re all my favorites. That was a special time. But That dude came back and won an Academy Award.
“No Country For Old Men”
Q: What was it like for you [to make “No Country For Old Men”]? You’re beginning your career. You’re hoping to book roles. You’re taking whatever you can get. But after doing “No Country,” it opened doors for you. What is it like now, where you’re getting offered the best stuff out there. People are like, “Oh, can we get Josh Brolin?”
Josh Brolin: Listen, man, I could get emotional about it. you have no idea. When you know what it’s like, I’m so lucky. I remember seeing Matt Damon in “Good Will Hunting.” I went and bought a jacket with a stripe, the same jacket, literally, in my 30s. I did that. I was so inspired by the acting that he did in that movie. But I know what it was like for 22 years after “The Goonies” to really… Maybe I’d do a series, and my poster would be up on Times Square. It’d be up on Sunset Boulevard. And the thing would last, like, seven episodes. then, womp, womp. And then it didn’t go.
So, after that I knew what it was like for things not to work. And literally, any role that was offered, you’d go, “Yes. Hey, I got these three days that I’m doing in Milwaukee.”
You have to wear fishnet stockings. Fine. I’ll do it. It doesn’t matter. Then, suddenly, with “No Country.” You know the story. I’ve told it before; I’ll just tell some of it. I had sent in an audition. The response was, “Who lit it?” Robert Rodriguez and Quentin Tarantino had filmed the audition. They didn’t even mention me. because I was doing “Grind House”. So, it was my agent who got me into that last audition.
I did that audition. They gave me scenes at, I think, 10 o’clock the night before. Six scenes to learn. I went down there at 9 o’clock the next morning. I was in the hallway. The guy who was basically going to get it was coming out. They were all laughing together. [ha ha ha!!] I was like, “I’m dead in the water, I’m not going to get this.” I went in, and did probably three or four scenes. Then, Ethan asked me as I was doing it. Ethan said, “Can you do a West Texas accent?” Okay. He goes, “Oh, okay, good.” My mom’s from Texas, so I know the Texas accent pretty well.
I was like, I’m definitely not getting this. Then I left. By noon that day, I got a call from Joel and Ethan that said, “We’re curious to know if you would like to be in our film.” I was like, “Hold on a second. Let me check.” [laughter] “Yes!”And it did change everything. I remember I wanted it as the last thing. I wanted it [because] I knew it was a good movie. We didn’t know it was that kind of a movie. It didn’t feel that way when we were filming. We just had a really good time. But I knew after it hit me that I went, “I don’t want this just to be one thing.” I knew the main thing was to work with great directors. I really focused on great directors. I was lucky to be able to work with great directors. You make better movies with great directors. 100%.
“Weapons”
Q: You recently shot “Weapons” which is the new film made by the director of “Barbarian,” Zack Cregger. He made this new movie with a cryptic name, “Weapons.” [It’s now a hit]. You are one of the stars and executive producer. What can you tell us about it? What was about the script that said, “Oh yes, I’m doing this?”
Josh Brolin: It’s one of those scripts, it’s a new thing. It’s like once in a while you have a new voice, and new voices are scary. You know, it’s like imagining Scorsese when he was doing “Taxi Driver,” when he was doing “Mean Streets,” and people were like, what is this? I love it, but it is. So you get a new voice. Zack Cregger is a new voice. And I saw “Barbarian” and I really loved it. But I was, because I’m kind of an old school guy. So I called my daughter, Eden. I was like, what do you think of [Cregger’s debut] movie, “Barbarian?”
Q: Your five-year-old? [laughter]
Josh Brolin: I called Eden, my 31-year-old. I said, “Have you seen “Barbarian?” She was like, “Oh my God, that’s the greatest.” And then she went off, and I started talking to other people. And then I read this new script, “Weapons,” and I thought it was just really very smartly designed. You know, once in a while you throw the dice, and you hope that somebody is truly a new voice and a great new filmmaker. We’ll see.
Other Things
Q: Are you going to do Broadway?
Josh Brolin: Yeah, we’ve been looking. There was a play that I was offered recently that I said no to, but we’re looking for a new, exciting play to do on Broadway.
Q: What play?
Josh Brolin: Don’t know yet, man. I’m excited about it and excited to get back to New York.
Q: Do you know what else you’re doing in the future besides looking for a play?
Josh Brolin: Let’s get off it. How much am I making? I don’t know. I don’t know what that is. No, I, listen, man, it’s all boring shit. I wrote a play. I want to get that play done. You know, I wrote a book. The book comes out next month. I chose not to work for the rest of the year. I’m working in January. I like the options right now. Things are really fun right now. I don’t know why, at 56 years old. You know, I just, again, we’re mixing it up. We’re looking.
The Actor
Q: What’s it been like the last few years, some of the privileges you’ve had as an actor, the doors that have opened for you to be able to maybe go to a restaurant that is impossible to go to, or meet people that are, you know what I mean? Those kinds of privileges that happen from being a celebrity.
Josh Brolin: That’s a good question, because it’s like this memoir thing. It’s like the typical memoir is, you know, I knew when I was four, I wanted to be an actor. And my family saw it because I loved to perform in front of them in the living room. Then I tried to be an actor, and it was tough for about six months. I got a job, and then I met really famous people, and my life has been fantastic. That’s kind of like the typical memoir, you know what I mean? The typical memoir, not all of them.
Mine isn’t like that. It’s a very different kind of thing. even, like, I was on the plane yesterday to come here, and a woman, I’m reading George Saunders’ book, what is it called? A Swim In a Pond in the Rain and it’s about, anyway, Russian short stories and all this kind of shit. this woman saw it, and she goes,” Oh, I love that book,” and I said, “Me too. she goes, “Yeah, I’m a writer.” I said, “Oh, cool, I have a book coming out.”
She said, “What’s your name?” I said, “Josh.” And she goes — I found out she’s hard of hearing — “We got to know each other.
She said, “JOSH WHAT!” I said, “BROLIN!” She goes, “OKAY! WHEN DOES IT COME OUT?” I said, cool. I get these moments where I go, “Man, I hope I make it.” Then she knew somebody who was a mutual friend, and they go, “What, how did you not know who it is?”
That happens to me often. I’m very lucky that I’m able to go down the street and not get mobbed, necessarily. But what I get, and I don’t know why this is, maybe it’s because of the parts I play. Maybe because my face looks so Neanderthal or angry or something. That’s what I get in New York. My favorite place is to be in New York, for real, because people look at you, and they’re like, “YO, MAN! RESPECT!” And I go, ” love that.” That’s my favorite.
Q: When you meet Josh on the street…
Josh Brolin: Respect! It’s true. It’s my favorite, because it just happens in a moment, and then it’s done. | then you get on with life. So, as a privileged thing, like, yes, to be around incredibly creative people, but what I’ve found, and the whole point of that story is, what I’ve found is the most creative people –– we’re talking about Harris Savides, we’re talking about Greig Fraser, we’re talking about Denis Villeneuve –– is they have the least amount of ego.
There’s the most collaboration. There’s the most, not like, “Oh, I have an idea, I’m an actor, I want to have my stamp on this thing.” And you go, “Yeah, but is it really a good idea?” No. Or, maybe it is a good idea, and they go, “Oh my God, that’s a great idea. You know what I mean? There’s a feeling of, we’re just trying to make the best story we can here. Whereas I’ve found, in the past, and even in the present, there’s certain actors, even, and directors and all that that I’ve worked with. They are more concerned with how they’re being perceived than what they’re actually doing.
I like that. Is it really about getting the seat at the restaurant, or? Because I go to Denny’s a lot, man. I’ve got young kids, and I’m kind of cheap. So, you know, and then once … Moon’s over Mi-HAM-i. I have it often. There’s that thing of like, look, obviously you like making money. and obviously there’s something nice when somebody invites you into something. But I always –– you know, we’re telling human stories. The minute you become inhuman, the minute you become exclusive, how are you in a position to tell those human stories that people can identify with? Isn’t the whole point is in telling a story that the masses can identify with?
Yes, there’s a point to escapism, and that is wonderful, too. I think when you look at even “Avengers,” what people like specifically about what I did in it was the fact that they felt for the guy. So they got confused. You’re getting rid of half the universe, but why do we like him? I did the same thing with, and I remember the parallel, same thing with Dan White, who killed Mayor Moscone and Harvey Milk.
But there was something about the walk, I remember I asked Gus Van Sant, I said, “You did this great walk in “Elephant.” Would you do that walk [in his film “Milk”] after Dan [White] shoots Mayor Moscone and has to walk the entirety of City Hall to get to Harvey? I want to see what’s going on in his face, I want to see if there’s a moment where he’s questioning himself. Or is he in that thing and he refuses to let go because he’s so insecure at that point.I don’t want to lose that humanity, I don’t want to lose the ability to be able to walk the street and watch people, you know what I mean? I’ve found a niche. Or I’ve been allowed a niche that still allows me that. And it still allows me to have choice in our chosen profession, which I’m very grateful for. Thank you.